44-83785 Markings

[terveurn]

44-83785a BB.JPG

44-83785 bb.JPG

[aerovin2]

As discussed in another posting, I don't think the top one is 44-83785; I think it is 44-8990, for what it is worth. From the information I have there is little doubt that the Mary Winn II was the aircraft used to fly Churchill around and in 1946 and the Mary Winn II was 44-8990. The markings on the nose from my photos of that assignment and the photo posted here match exactly, as to the antenna or ? that is mounted above the right cheek window. The vertical antenna behind the top turret patch is not shown in the view posted here, but it is visible on all the views of the airplane in 1946. For what it is worth.

[aerovin2]

Interesting color footage of Churchill and Mary Winn II during the 1946 visit seen here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utZ7mu4lht0. No views of the tail serial in the footage but stills from the same time show 44-8990.

[Chris Brame]

You can just barely see the "48..." on the tail here in that distinctive Lockheed Vega stencil font:


I stitched together parts of three frames to get this full shot of the nose:


Left side:


Interesting to note that the painter who did the nose art managed to duplicate it perfectly - including its position - on the right side of 44-83785.

[terveurn]

I am sitting hear reading what the heck is going on.....

Both of the images I posted came from the same source / sequence and here come Chris with the the same nose art (minus the 85A) but on a different aircraft -- wtf ---

the 85A is interesting as the cheek package is layered over the last three / serial number.

The film posted also shows this B-17 from the left side and it also has the name painted on (wish you could read the s/n) but it has no US Air Force markings

I will let Scott mediate as he is the post WWII B-17 expert

btw - how the heck do you post photos so you do not need to log in

Mary winn.JPG

[Chris Brame]

I am logged in - otherwise I can't even see the photos, let alone post 'em .
I tried to enhance the data block but it just isn't sharp enough - however (1) it's short enough to be a four-digit suffix, and (2) the B&W shot of the left side of '785 shows the data block about 8"-10" to the left of where it is on '990 - and I don't see any nose art .

ETA: There's a recent thread about '990 on the Wreckchasing Message Board that includes a couple newspaper articles about the crash on 10/10/62:
https://pacaeropress.websitetoolbox.com ... 1305231257

[aerovin2]

This was discussed in an earlier post: https://www.aerovintage.com/forum/viewt ... f=1&t=4656

The pilot who flew Mary Winn II in 1946 was based at Bolling Field as was 44-8990, as per the aircraft record card. 44-83785 never was assigned to Bolling. My explanation is that the top photo of this posting is not related to the second photo of this posting. It appears obvious both photos were taken post 1947 for the USAF marking visible. The overmounting of the numbers under the cheek window on the top photo is a mystery...the apparent numbers of 85A or 35A or 95A a coincidence. Why in 1947 or later was the cheek fairing removed and then numbers painted, and then later the cheek fairing replaced??? Great question.

My two cents.