The "Hawaiian Air Depot" Camouflage Scheme

[OldBillB17F]

Thanks for the clarification, Steve!

[Steve Birdsall]

There's a feast for the eyes at https://www.google.com/culturalinstitut ... %20Pacific.

Some people at "other" sites have been indulging in some wishful thinking, so I'll note in advance that . . .

• There’s no B-17s painted overall “blue” or “gray” there.

• What remained of 41-2616 the “Blue Goose” was lying on the bottom of the ocean when Ralph Morse took these photos.

• There is no “Synthetic Haze”-painted B-17 or special “recon” B-17 shown there.

They’re just 11th Bomb Group B-17Es (and one B-17F) . . . predominantly from the 72nd (which was attached to the 11th at the time), 98th and 431st squadrons. Half-a-dozen wearing the "Hawaiian Air Depot scheme", the rest standard Dark Olive Drab and Neutral Gray.

[Steve Birdsall]

I’ve got an article about the eight B-17Es that arrived over Hawaii during the 7 December 1941 Pearl Harbor attacks in the next issue of Aviation History that might be of interest (although there are still quite a few questions to be answered).



All eight were quickly reassigned to Hawaiian Air Force squadrons and overpainted with the unique multi-colored camouflage scheme to protect them on the ground.

[aerovin2]

I'll look forward to that article. Interesting stuff posted in this thread.

[Steve Birdsall]

By now I hope some of you have seen the Aviation History article. It was a bit vague about the Hawaiian Air Depot camouflage so Jack Fellows and I thought we should try to explain it a bit more.

Jack’s profile shows 41-2434, one of the B-17Es that arrived in Hawaii on 7 December 1941. This is what we think it looked like in July 1942, complete with some crudely-repaired tail damage courtesy of a Zero over Lae, New Guinea on 3 July 1942.

By that time the paint on these planes had been exposed to harsh environments for seven months and in some black-and-white photos some of the colors appear to have rapidly faded and the borders between them have become indistinct.

The only color reference we have is John Ford’s Midway film, but available prints are all degraded to varying degrees. The one color that we can be absolutely certain about is the Olive Drab 41 “saddle” surrounding the radio room hatch. It was common to all these aircraft.

Also common were the “rust” nose, the washed-out “sand” color forward of the OD 41 and the blue-gray area around the waist, the latter most likely sourced from U.S. Navy paint stocks.

If anybody has photos or information that might help sort this out please don’t hold back.

[terveurn]

Steve

Did you know that the Film Preservation Board has restored John ford "The Battle Of Midway" to its original color and presentation and you might be able to get a copy from MOMA

Midway.jpg

[Steve Birdsall]

Thanks Dave. It all depends on the quality of the print they began with, but certainly worth a try.

The B-17 sequences were shot on 6 June 1942 and there may be "cuts and outs" but I can't find them . . . it was technically official U.S. Navy footage, but John Ford apparently held on to it.

[terveurn]

Here's what I'm talking about . . . both photos were taken at Townsville, Australia.



None of these aircraft had exactly the same paint job, and that's proved to be both a blessing and a curse. In this particular case, a blessing.

A bit more information . . . that's Lt Frank Bostrom's crew posing with 41-2416 in February 1942.

Visible as you look at the photo are navigator Rob Roy Carruthers first on the left, unknown, Frank Bostrom, unknown, co-pilot Wilson L. Cook then four more unknown.

I can only positively identify those three at this time, but hopefully someone can identify some of the others.

Must be a set of these photos - almost the same, but the figures have moved

41-2416.jpg

[Steve Birdsall]

This is one I'd like to know a lot more about - 41-2421, the plane that took part in the Royce raid in April 1942.



The photo was taken after the aircraft arrived in Australia in February 1942. Later Its undersurfaces were painted a “sky color” in an apparently “one-off” experiment. The total lack of a radio call number remains unexplained.

[Steve Birdsall]

And the other side of 41-2434 . . .

[varsity07840]

This is one I'd like to know a lot more about - 41-2421, the plane that took part in the Royce raid in April 1942.



The photo was taken after the aircraft arrived in Australia in February 1942. Later Its undersurfaces were painted a “sky color” in an apparently “one-off” experiment. The total lack of a radio call number remains unexplained.

Also, note the lack of tail stripes.

[Chris Brame]

Is that a smudge, or is there a very faint "21" on the tail?

[Steve Birdsall]

It's a blemish on the print or in the paintwork . . . I've seen three or four prints of this shot and can't quite figure it out.

As Duane noted, this plane had its rudder stripes over-painted (or the rudder replaced) in Australia . . . either way they've matched the new paintwork to the existing camouflage on the tail. Same for 41-2408.

[Dan Johnson]

Is that a smudge, or is there a very faint "21" on the tail?

Interesting. I see 23

[varsity07840]

It's a blemish on the print or in the paintwork . . . I've seen three or four prints of this shot and can't quite figure it out.

As Duane noted, this plane had its rudder stripes over-painted (or the rudder replaced) in Australia . . . either way they've matched the new paintwork to the existing camouflage on the tail. Same for 41-2408.

I must say that I've never seen a HAD B-17 with tail stripes over painted with a matching camo scheme. 408 had a single dark color on the rudder, possibly fresh OD.