"Best Years" B-17E ID narrowed down, maybe

[Chris Brame]

This has been an elusive one but I believe I've narrowed it down to four possible (two probable). Here's an enlargement of the one frame with some of the serial visible:

And a shot of the nose clearly showing the name Carol Jean:


To me at least, the last two digits look like "93". Going through Joe Baugher's lists, the best match seems to be 41-9093:

9093 delivered to Geiger 301st BG Apr 8, 1942; transferred to Lowry May 31, 1942; assigned 5th BG 72nd BS ("Spook!") at Hawaii
Jun 7, 1942; RETUS 2138 BU at Tyndall Dec 27, 1942; transferred to Kingman 22-Oct 22, 1944; transferred to
RFC at Albuquerque Jun 25, 1945

Problem is it ended up at Albuquerque and the info on the film I've found doesn't mention any filming there. So I looked up all the B-17Es that went to RFC at Ontario and came up with only three: 41-9068 on 10-31-45, 41-9160 on 4-11-45 and 41-9065 on 8-12-45. Of those three I think 41-9068 may be the closest to that image and it was the last to show up at Ontario; according to the book Retakes, the movie was shot April-August 1946.

So my two best guesses for Carol Jean's ID: 41-9093 or 41-9068.

What do you all think?

[Steve Birdsall]

Not much help really but 41-9093 did not have enlarged cheek gun windows when in combat in the South Pacific. Is it likely that they would have been added later?

[aerovin2]

I haven't seen the film recently but any chance it was just stock footage of the B-17E? Hard to figure the film makers would get permission to fire up a mothballed B-17E and let the film crew do a taxi/takeoff scene. The scene immediately preceding the scene the still came from, if I recall correctly, has them walking up the aft waist and boarding the airplane. Probably not the same B-17 used in both shots was my conclusion when I looked at the film closely several years ago.

I suspected it was Mantz's B-17F used for the embarking scene; I don't think a serial number is visible.

[Steve Birdsall]

All good points. The plane in that takeoff sequence also appears to be fully armed.

The only times I've come across the name Carol Jean it was on planes from the 301st Bomb Group . . . 41-24404 was Carol Jean III and 42-5137 was Carol Jean IV. Could be relevant, but a real longshot.

[Dan Johnson]

Gonna have to find my DVD of that film. Looks like another mystery to chase. I always wondered what a B17E would be doing still around postwar like that.

Just looked around a bit on Youtube. The large glass window on the left side of the nose is forward in the nose interior shots. You can also see what appears to be the edge of the astrodome above their heads. They are looking out the framed glass of an early model 17 though.

[Steve Birdsall]

It’s pretty clear that the B-17 that Dana Andrews and Harold Russell climb aboard is not the same as the plane in the takeoff sequence.

[hang the expense]

The film of the E model looks to be a wartime training film clip.I would doubt an E model would have survived the war in a fully out fitted condition or with really good paint for that matter.I love all this detective work that goes on here.Thanks to you, Steve and everyone.

[hang the expense]

It’s pretty clear that the B-17 that Dana Andrews and Harold Russell climb aboard is not the same as the plane in the takeoff sequence.

I dont think this B-17 is Paul Mantz bird.This bird looks way too dry around the engine and prop.The oil on the bottom side of the wing and nacells looks to be quite old.My bet its one of the birds yet to be stripped at chino.Looks dirty enough

[aerovin2]

Could be at Chino but that becomes the big question, then. There has always been a bit of a question about Mantz's B-17F as to how much it flew, if ever, and where it was between 1946 and 1950. It was at Stillwater in the boneyard that Mantz bought and rescued it from in February 1946. It may (or may not) have been at Van Nuys Airport in the late spring of 1948 for the filming of "Fighter Squadron" and "Command Decision". Beyond that, little is know. Doubtful it flew much, if at all, in the period, and it did not receive a civil registration until 1950, shortly before Mantz sold it. Could the scene in "Best Years of Our Lives" been filmed at Van Nuys in mid 1946 with Mantz's airplane after one flight from Oklahoma? Or was the scene shot at Chino after the film makers got permission to tug an airplane off the scrap line to where the scene was shot?